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keyword analysis

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keyword analysis

Postby jwcashflow » Sun May 01, 2005 2:30 pm

Hi,
I am performing a bit of keyword analysis to help create a domain name as well as trying to formulate the direction of my content with the remaining words. This is how I am going about it and would love a solid critique:

First I am going to http://www.pixelfast.com/overture/ After placing a keyword in, I copy and paste the # of searches with the search term performed last month (located on the right side) and place it into excel. After having some fun and placing all the relevant search terms in, I have quite a large list ( to me anyway) of 1000+ keywords. Next is to delete the duplicates, the oddball phrases, the phrases which are naughty and the phrases which would not make sense as content written the way they are. Now I am trying to gauge the remaining keywords on 2 factors. Relevancy (which I am winging) and # of searches last month. Anything I could be doing better?

Competition analysis:
I am playing with a site which watches keywords from a domain http://www.digitalpoint.com/tools/keywo ... n=advanced Can anyone explain for me what a back link is and why it’s important? Also, how can I gauge some of my competitors? The success of their keywords and how I can be successful or end up higher in the search results then them?

I actually emailed a potential competitor asking how they were making money, and he had the same question. :) Meaning they are not. Funny, but not very informative. Who knows if they are telling the truth or not. How can I find out how other competitors are fairing? Is there a way to check out how others are actually performing legally or at a minimum gauge their success? Unique visitors and/or actual sales or profit? What links are working for them, keywords, anything I am missing?

Thank you for this forum,
JW
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Re: keyword analysis

Postby Lynn Terry » Sun May 01, 2005 6:22 pm

Hi JW,

jwcashflow wrote:First I am going to http://www.pixelfast.com/overture/ After placing a keyword in, I copy and paste the # of searches with the search term performed last month (located on the right side) and place it into excel. After having some fun and placing all the relevant search terms in, I have quite a large list ( to me anyway) of 1000+ keywords. Next is to delete the duplicates, the oddball phrases, the phrases which are naughty and the phrases which would not make sense as content written the way they are. Now I am trying to gauge the remaining keywords on 2 factors. Relevancy (which I am winging) and # of searches last month. Anything I could be doing better?


This all sounds good. Keep in mind that Overture lumps the singular & plural forms of any word together and shows them both in singular form. To be sure on that, double check your keyword phrases through the free trial at WordTracker.


jwcashflow wrote:Competition analysis:
I am playing with a site which watches keywords from a domain http://www.digitalpoint.com/tools/keywo ... n=advanced Can anyone explain for me what a back link is and why it’s important? Also, how can I gauge some of my competitors? The success of their keywords and how I can be successful or end up higher in the search results then them?


Back links (also called Inbound Links) are links IN to your web page from a web page on another domain. How many Inbound Links you have coming in to any given page will determine it's Link Popularity. The quality of those links (how relevant the page is that is linking to yours, and the text that they link your URL to) determine's the Link Reputation. These are the two most important factors in Search Engine Optimization (SEO).

You can find out how easy it would be for one of your pages to rank higher in the search engines for any given term by analyzing the pages that are currently listed in the top 10. While you can look at their pages to determine "on the page optimization", the most important thing to look at is their Inbound Links and the quality of those links.

I outlined that in this issue of SSWT:
http://www.selfstartersweeklytips.com/a ... 122104.htm

You may also want to see:
Understanding Keywords - Choosing Them & Using Them



jwcashflow wrote:How can I find out how other competitors are fairing? Is there a way to check out how others are actually performing legally or at a minimum gauge their success? Unique visitors and/or actual sales or profit? What links are working for them, keywords, anything I am missing?


Not that I know of - not one that is exact, anyway. The best way to tell is to 'test the market' by setting up a Pay-per-Click campaign on Google Adwords or Overture. But you can also take a look at how much competitors are paying per click for your chosen search terms, and that should give you some indication as to whether the market is profitable or not. Obviously they wouldnt continue to pour money in if it was a loss...
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Postby Sharon & Roy » Sun May 01, 2005 7:03 pm

::: No Keyword Research & Analysis Is Complete Without Wordtracker :::

jwcashflow wrote:I am performing a bit of keyword analysis to help create a domain name as well as trying to formulate the direction of my content with the remaining words. This is how I am going about it and would love a solid critique:

First I am going to http://www.pixelfast.com/overture/ After placing a keyword in, I copy and paste the # of searches with the search term performed last month (located on the right side) and place it into excel. After having some fun and placing all the relevant search terms in, I have quite a large list (to me anyway) of 1000+ keywords. Next is to delete the duplicates, the oddball phrases, the phrases which are naughty and the phrases which would not make sense as content written the way they are. Now I am trying to gauge the remaining keywords on 2 factors. Relevancy (which I am winging) and # of searches last month. Anything I could be doing better?


Hi JW,

We advise you to continue your keyword research to build your INITIAL list by using various books and magazines as well as a thesaurus. Another good tool is the Google Sandbox < https://adwords.google.com/select/KeywordSandbox > and Google Suggest < http://labs.google.com/suggest >.

We also advise you to use Teoma's "Refine" search list < http://s.teoma.com/search?q=gift+baskets > located in the upper right hand side of the page. Here you can discover many related keywords for your main keywords.

AltaVista has a similar feature called "Related Searches" < http://www.altavista.com/web/results?q=gift+baskets > as does AlltheWeb called "Refine your search" < http://www.alltheweb.com/search?q=gift+baskets >.


Once you have finished your INITIAL keyword list we advise you to compare them with Wordtracker < http://www.wordtracker.com/trial/popula ... ft+baskets >.

Wordtracker will provide you with a more accurate list of keywords and it will also provide you with a more accurate number of daily searches than any other keyword tool, including Overture < http://inventory.overture.com/d/searchi ... %20baskets >.

For example, look at the top 5 results given for the term ... gift baskets ... below on Wordtracker and Overture. The second chart compares the numbers given for Overture and Wordtracker for the daily searches.

.............................
Wordtracker Daily Searches
.............................
05/01/05
.............................
gift baskets 4710
gourmet gift baskets 649
holiday gift baskets 624
christmas gift baskets 542
unique gift baskets 526
.............................



.............................
Overture Monthly Searches
.............................
05/01/05
.............................
456915 gift basket (15230 vs 4710)
327815 baby gift basket (10927 vs 317)
47000 wine gift basket (1566 vs 521)
26751 christmas gift basket (891 vs 245)
26739 food gift basket (891 vs 252)
.............................



Below are the differences between singulars and plurals on Wordtracker which is not distinguished between on Overture. Overture will only display the singular. Also, word order is not distinguished between on Overture.

.............................
Wordtracker Daily Searches
.............................
05/01/05
.............................
baby shower gift baskets 270
baby shower gift basket 67

baby gift baskets 327
baby gift basket 317

christmas gift baskets 542
christmas gift basket 245

food gift baskets 383
food gift basket 252
.............................


We provide these charts so that you will notice that if you don't use Wordtracker for your final analysis, you could end up optimizing for the wrong keywords not to mention that you may end up anticipating a higher daily search amount for your keywords than they will actually produce.

jwcashflow wrote:Competition analysis:

I am playing with a site which watches keywords from a domain http://www.digitalpoint.com/tools/keywo ... n=advanced Can anyone explain for me what a back link is and why it's important?


A "backlink" or as Google refers to them, "backward links" are simply links to a page from another page.

They are important because once you have optimized your page and someone else has optimized their page for the same keyword phrase, then the backward links are used in the algorithm to determine which page should be ranked higher.

jwcashflow wrote:Also, how can I gauge some of my competitors? The success of their keywords and how I can be successful or end up higher in the search results then them?


While there is no EXACT way to gauge this, the simple answer is to learn how many backward links your competitors have and then to acquire more backward links. (PLEASE NOTE: Ranking higher than your competitors is not quite as easy as this, but it does give you a "target" to shoot at.)

jwcashflow wrote:How can I find out how other competitors are fairing?


Other than asking them, you can't.

jwcashflow wrote:Is there a way to check out how others are actually performing legally or at a minimum gauge their success? Unique visitors and/or actual sales or profit? What links are working for them, keywords, anything I am missing?


No.

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Sharon and Roy Montero
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Postby avrr » Mon May 02, 2005 11:43 am

Hi JW,

Very wise advice you got from Lynn and Sharon.

Don't compete for single highest search words. Try to put a phrase. Example- if you are selling 'shoes', you can put keywords like 'tennis shoes'.

Though you are selling all kinds of shoes, try to keep this type of phrases in your key words. If your site is on 1000th page for 'shoes', can get with in 5 pages if you use the 'tennis shoes'.

My 2 cents :)
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Postby jwcashflow » Mon May 02, 2005 1:36 pm

Thank you all for the explanations...and links.

Sharon and Roy stated
"the simple answer is to learn how many backward links your competitors have and then to acquire more backward links"
Could someone go a little more in-depth about doing this? Or would someone drudge through a competitors site and literally count there links. Do back links include affiliate links?

Other than finding competitors through keyword analysis, I have been utilizing http://www.ucmore.comThis helps me find competitors or somewhat similar categorical groupings. Is there any other ways to hunt down competition or should I feel confident once all the keywords are covered?

"We provide these charts so that you will notice that if you don't use Wordtracker for your final analysis, you could end up optimizing for the wrong keywords not to mention that you may end up anticipating a higher daily search amount for your keywords than they will actually produce. "

Can someone explain why there so different? Should I abandon the Overture site all together?

P.S. Lynn, still devouring your articles. Thank you

JW
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Postby Lynn Terry » Mon May 02, 2005 2:07 pm

This is the information you'll find within those articles, but I wanted to give you specific answers to your questions here on the forum:

JW wrote:Can someone explain why there so different? Should I abandon the Overture site all together?


Two things to note:

1) WordTracker shows us the approximate number of DAILY searches. Overture, or any tool using Overture's database, shows us the approximate number of searches done in a month. In addition, the numbers will vary as each tool queries different sources to gather this data.

This is NOT an exact science ;)


2) You should never use a "general" keyword in your marketing campaigns - whether you are promoting via SEO or PPC, or any other method. General words, such as "TV" or "television", simply do not convert well. Very specific keywords, or search terms, are much more focused - and more likely to attract an interested, and perhaps even pre-sold, buyer.

In fact, "sharp aquos 26 inch lcd tv" is a better keyword to use than just "lcd tv". The person that typed that into Google or Yahoo KNOWS what they are looking for, and now they are looking for more information or for the best deal. They are more than likely "pre-sold" on this exact model.

Obviously those specific or obscure search terms receive less searches per day or month than the more general terms. However, they convert MUCH better, so it's a good trade-off


JW wrote: Sharon and Roy stated
"the simple answer is to learn how many backward links your competitors have and then to acquire more backward links"
Could someone go a little more in-depth about doing this? Or would someone drudge through a competitors site and literally count there links. Do back links include affiliate links?


Here's an example, using the keyword phrase sharp lcd tv:

If you go to Yahoo.com and type "sharp lcd tv" into the search field, you'll see that the first listing is SharpUSA.com

You can see how many "backward links" they have by typing:

link:http://www.sharpusa.com

... into the search box at Yahoo. Backward links are links pointing to that page (not to the "site" but to that specific page, which in this case is the main page of the site) FROM another URL (or web page).

The number of backward links that you can obtain from relevant web pages has an effect on how well that page ranks in the major search engines. This is in addition to your "on-the-page optimization", so you'll want to make sure that you know how to optimize a web page correctly - and then you can work on gaining the number of Inbound or Backward Links that you will need to improve your ranking.


SharpUSA.com has almost 2,000 backward links. If you search for "sharp lcd tv" (without quotes) on Google.com, the 3rd result is: avdeals.com/sharplcd/sharplcd.htm .

We have to go back to Yahoo.com to find out how many backward links this URL has, because Google does not give an accurate number. In Yahoo's search box, you can type:

link:http://www.avdeals.com/sharplcd/sharplcd.htm


They show 31 backward links for this URL. You probably only see 3 of those results. You'll have to click "repeat the search with the omitted results included" to see them all. You'll find that most of those links come from their own domain (avdeals.com).

If we go back to Google and look at the 4th result for "sharp lcd tv" (without quotes), we find: sharp.co.uk/ . Again, we switch back to Yahoo and look at the backward links for this URL.

There are over 2,000.

So how is it that the 3rd page listed only had 31 backward links, yet ranked higher than the 4th page which had over 2,000?

Good question!

There are a lot of variables, including the on-the-page optimization factors, but one thing that we could look at is how relevant those backward links are, and what the anchor text of each link is.

Looking at that 3rd result (avdeals.com/sharplcd/sharplcd.htm) and their backward links, I noticed that the first one that Yahoo listed had an image linked to this page, with the alt text "Sharp LCD TV". This is what you call "anchor text" - it is either in the "alt" code of an image that is linked to your page, or it is the text that is linked to on a web page.

Most of their other pages contain a link that says "Back to Sharp LCD Main". Again, using the keywords "sharp lcd" in their anchor text.


Most of the backward links for sharp.co.uk/ are using the anchor text "Sharp" or a variety of other product names and keywords.


Just to go a step further, let's look at the 5th result on Google.com for "sharp lcd tv", which is:
danchan.com/feature/2001/04/28/sharplcd/sharplcd.htm

Using Yahoo to look up the backward links for this URL, I find 149. Most of those, again, are from their own domain (danchan.com).


My (non-expert, super-quick) conclusion:


You could easily obtain a top 5 listing on Google for "sharp lcd tv" with 30-100 relevant backward links that use "sharp lcd tv" in the anchor text.

By "relevant" I mean that the links point to YOUR page from another web page that has relevant content (about sharp, or tv's or LCD)... that is not on your domain. A link from any other relevant site - to yours.


NOTE: The numbers above may not be accurate any longer, as this example was written in December '04. However, the process is the same.


:arrow: By the way, I learned everything that I know from Sharon & Roy Montero, professional SEO consultants and hosts of the 6 Week Interactive Online SEO Class For The Do-It-Yourself Website Owner. VERY Highly Recommended! The fee for the class is a drop in the bucket compared to what you can earn once you learn the strategies and begin to implement them!
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Postby jwcashflow » Tue May 03, 2005 2:28 pm

Well cool! One of the potential competitors only had 9 back links to there front page. :) That should be doable.

For the SEO class, would you recommend that I have a site up, so I can tweak as we go through the class?

Could someone address the competitor part of the message? I was wondering if there are other sites or tools which allow you to search for competitors or somewhat similar categorical groupings.

Lynn, I liked the article on keywords, particularly about taking the listing, refining and combining. Thank you,

JW
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Postby Lynn Terry » Tue May 03, 2005 2:47 pm

For the SEO Class, you will be given assignments or projects to complete to help you learn "hands on" - so this will work for you whether you have your own site ready to develop or not ;)

I worked on a "test page" on the side when I first sat in on Sharon & Roy's class, and just put some affiliate creative (banners & text) on the page as I was going (just so that it wasnt completely blank). I ended up getting a good ranking for that page and making several thousand dollars in commission over the next few months!


As for competition, I generally analyze the SERPs (search engine result pages) more than anything else. The majority of what I am going to promote is going to be through the search engines (either free listings or paid listings) - so this is where I look. If you are going to be promoting offline, or locally, or anything else besides keyword-specific search engine listings... then you will want to look in those places to analyze your potential competition.

Keep in mind that "competition" can be a VERY good thing. Especially online! See: Using Competition To Your Advantage ;)

You'll also see "Link Strategy - Tips For Gaining Inbound Links!" on that same page, which you may find helpful at this stage.
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Postby Hock Ng » Mon May 09, 2005 8:49 am

This is a great thread Lynn, perhaps you should make it a sticky. :)

Another good resource I came across recently for keyword-digging is GoogSpy

It's priceless (and free too!).

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Postby jwcashflow » Mon May 09, 2005 3:06 pm

Hock,

Could you please explain the googspy and how you might utilize it in more detail? The data its pulling from is "Currently processing 5,688,130 search results” so, what sort of weight would you give something like this when Google Searches 8,058,044,651 web pages currently? It is fun though...It’s the first option to the UCMore add-on I was using for trying to help find potential groups competition I might not consider. Though, after reading the previous posts above, it would seem if I could:

• meld the advice and put effort into creating an all encompassing keyword database
• filter it through solid analysis from word tracker
• utilize these keywords to help create rich content
• research and incorporate backlinks which are high in relevancy

This should help strengthen my search rankings all without bidding $0.00 on the keywords. Hopefully it should help get within the top 5 listed for many of the frequented keywords. Correct? Am I missing anything?

Now, regarding the sites which are not in the first few pages of the SERPS, then would I care about them? Does anyone see a threat from these?

JW
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Postby Lynn Terry » Mon May 09, 2005 5:18 pm

jwcashflow wrote:Now, regarding the sites which are not in the first few pages of the SERPS, then would I care about them? Does anyone see a threat from these?


I consider the top 10 results for a particular keyword phrase to be "competing listings" - only. I dont generally research past those first ten results. That said, the listings change constantly, so it's a good idea to keep an eye on them each month, or every few months, to see if you need to place a few new links to maintain your position, etc.
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Postby Hock Ng » Mon May 09, 2005 6:54 pm

For example, go to GoogSpy and type in "marketingtips.com" which is Corey Rudl's site. On the next page, click on the link under "companies".

You'll see a list of terms that the site is ranked in the top 10 in Google. You'll also see what keywords they are bidding on with Adwords. I must warn you that the list is by no means complete. But it's still a great research tool to have.

Hock
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Postby jwcashflow » Sat May 14, 2005 3:09 am

Here is a funny way to check keywords, only if you are bored. http://www.googlefight.com/
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Postby Jason Moffatt » Sat Jun 18, 2005 3:45 pm

I was so glad to see you explain the "Backward" link trick through Yahoo search. I saw it on the "video", and it really lit some light bulbs. :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:

Thanks Lynn,

It was amazing to see some of the top ranked sites for my particular keyword phrases only had 14-20 backward links. This is awesome, as I can easily get that many. It's interesting to decipher what other things are taken into account for the ranking though, as I have seen some sites with almost no backwards links getting great rankings. It seems these sights are very optimized, and, or, have lots of unique and relevant content.
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Postby Lynn Terry » Mon Jun 20, 2005 9:09 am

It depends on which search engine they ranked well in. I would love to look at some examples. You are welcome to post them if you run across them again, or send them privately if you'd rather not share it on a public forum.

Yahoo tends to focus more on "on the page optimization" while Google favors "off the page optimization" (quality inbound links - your Link Popularity and Link Reputation).

If a site ranks well with hardly any backward links, then you can pretty much figure that the keyword phrase used is not very competitive. It's interesting too that some keyword phrases are VERY competitive when it comes to PPC, but the SERPs (search engine results pages) are not at all competitive for the same keyword phrase.
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